Northern Aerospace

Jay Oh Bee

2006-11-29T00:12:00.000-05:00

Well, I gots me a new jeorb today. I thought to myself, what kind of a job around here can I get that would be more applicable to my major and would be interesting that I could possibly get part time? Working on the vintage trains of the Grand Canyon Railroad. Wouldn't you know it, they were looking for an electrical type with experience with control and indicating systems.

I'm pretty darn excited to be working in their locomotive shop once finals are done instead of sitting around campus getting paid eight buck an hour to do nothing but rewind tapes......

WTF

2006-10-18T23:09:00.000-04:00

This is just too friggin funny....

School

2006-10-13T15:10:00.000-04:00

Well, I finally went and did it, Igot involved in an engineering project, and not just any project either, SAE Supermileage NAU has never competed in this competition before so this year has a brand new team and a brand new design. Now all we have to do is get some money together to get us to Michigan in June!

School

2006-09-25T15:48:00.000-04:00

So, now that the waiting to move and carry on with our lives is over,what do we do now? What's the next step? I've been feeling a little unsettled lately I think because I don't know exactly what that next step is. I know I want my master's degree and that I want to go to Grad School but, I also want to eat. I am currently an Astrophysics major, they dont' have an Astrophysics masters program here, I think I can actualy get my bachellor's done in two years. Do I stay here and get a masters either in Physics education or applied physics and go on to grad work wherever I can manage to get accepted? Or, do I skip town once I have my bachelor's degree and get my masters in something a little more up my alley and inline with what I want to do. I would rather put together a master's thesis on cosmology or theoretical physics rather than how to teach retarded high school students something most of them dont' want to bother with. Does it really matter what my bachelor's or masters is in to be able to get my PhD in Astrophysics?

I thought about speaking with my Astrophysics professor, and maybe I still wil but, I jsut feel like I'm in the way, like I'm just bothering these people who don't know me and may not have a vested interest in me as a student....I guess I could talk to my academic advosor as well but, I still feel aprehensive about the whole thing. I guess in a way I still feel like I'm back at JCC where they just want to get you through and into a job at the end and not necessarily give you a broader understanding of not only the world around you but, yourself as well. That and I feel that my acedemic advisor would push for the physics education masters because, that's what he's all about and he's trying to recruit anybody even remotely interested in the program.........

Kewl

2006-09-16T17:03:00.000-04:00

I ran across this site today looking for some information on a book my calc teacher had mentioned in class the other day. The notes I have are Cantor ( a methematician that went insane contemplating the infinite. The title of the book that I was given was "The search for the Aleph" and was supposed to be a story of Cantor's life and work but, alas, I seem to have come up empty handed. I did find a title by one of my favorite authors Amir D. Aczel titled, "The Mystery of the ALEPH" but, can't find that at my campus library either wich surprises me becasue the library at NAU is riggin HUGE....

Star Wars

2006-09-11T10:04:00.000-04:00

Amen brother...

Transportation, Check

2006-09-08T22:56:00.000-04:00

Well, I finally gave up on getting a kick-ass chopper bike and decided to just go to wally-world and get a cheap-ass mountain bike. Something that would give me some good ol transportation back and forth to classes. Well, lo and behold, there sat a fresh new wicked green Schwinn Stingray. I was totally amazed. I oh so carefully got it off the rack and set it on the floor, still sure that it would just be way too small. It wasn't. I even asked my dear wife the untimate litmus question, "do I look stupid?" her answer was no so, as we speak it sits lovingly locked to the bike rack just outside my window, I haven't even ridden it yet with the exception of the four feet in wally-world. The best part, I only paid $79 for it, not $179 but, just $79. My dear wife even asked if the price was correct at the register after it rang up for a bit less than expected. The cashier checked it out and said, "yup, it rings up as $79.00". Sweet...

WTF

2006-09-05T13:56:00.000-04:00

Ok, these images really freak me out. Especially the dental asistant, it looks more like the hand of Jesus is stedying the hand of dental tourture. Jus tlook at the face of the guy being worked on, this is jsut freaky... And what's up with the golfer image, where the hell is the other half of Jebus and why does he seem inpatient, is he waiting for his turn, will he be taking this guy away after he makes this last put and dies of cardiac arrest? I will not sleep tonight thanx to these images......

Transportation

2006-09-04T22:48:00.000-04:00

So, the process of getting from the science building to the SBS building sux. I have only made it to Folklore ontime once. This got me to thinkin, I really need a bike. But, what kind of bike. The bike you ride says as much about you as what kind of car you drive wich, incidentally is an 89 Lincoln Town Car, grey, big, and rusting. I was really thinking about one of those off the shelf cruiser bikes like the Schwinn Stinray. It's one boss bike, but I may not exactly fit it all that well as it is a smaller bike and I'm 5'10" and 33. So I started looking around, Taget has a cruiser that's not quite as cool but, is for adults. Unsatisfied I looked some more and found this. That's just super-fuckin'-cool. Now only if I can get access to the campus machine shop (I don't even relaly kow if it exists or where it might be).

After thinking about this project for a little while I started remembering why I got out of engineering, I love to make the plans, figure out the details, then I'm done. Would I ever really get this thing made before I graduate. Hell, will I ever graduate even?

At any rate, I started evaluating what my needs are and it turns out, I needs something practical, something to ride over all kinds of terrain, and something that can cut in and out of both vehicular traffic as well as pedestrians and it looks like the Overkill isn't it. I still want to build this bike someday but, not becasue I need wheels, because I want to build it and someday ride it, not to get my ass back and forth to classes within a week or two...

someday Overkill, someday......

NAU

2006-09-04T20:54:00.000-04:00

Well, first week of school down and everything seems OK. I was really worried about both Calc II and Physics II. Calc was weird becasue the calc I that I took was definitly not the calc I that is taught here and everyone really seemed farther ahead than me even though I have been through calc II. After the professor went over homework questions wich was almost half of the questions assigned I didn't feel like everyone was light years ahead of me anymore, that and he gave us an extension on the due date wich was great...Physics was a question too untill we had our first quiz, was really easy and I got a prefect score but, we'll see how the rest of them go, the homework that he assigns is much harder than the quiz questions, hopefully nothing will come up behind me this semster...

anyway, the library here is great too! It's friggin huge and they have so much, I guess moving from a piddly little community college that had one stack of scinece books to a university library that had a room of scince books makes a difference...

Finally Here

2006-08-26T02:17:00.000-04:00

Well, we have finally made it to Flagstaff, Arizona and I for one, am very glad I don't have to move for a looooong time. I have been very impressed so far, by NAU. Not only are the facilities and the campus set in one of the most scenic backdrops imagineable but, the people here are great. I have never had such an easy time getting things done like, ID cards, parking permits, moving into housing. It was amazing how much everyone was customer service oriented and as a student, i felt that I really mattered!

I have already had a chance to speak with a few of my professors and look forward to speaking with them throughout the semester. There is one physics professor in particular that I seemed to make an immediate connection with and that seemed genuinely interested in me as well.

well, more later, for now I still need to get used to this 3 hour time difference....

CLM

2006-06-26T10:09:00.000-04:00

I remember my first CLM (Career Limiting Move) I was working as a tlecom engineer and was surfing the web for some good prices on phones and every freaking site I went to was crap, dad links, links that went to the wrong product. Finally I get to one last site and I'm so pissed that I find the wemaster address and send him an email with my company email address. It went something like this;

"I can't stand this crap you call HTML, this programming for this website is so bad it makes me truly sick to my stomach"

there was more but, those were really thetwo statements that mattered in the email. Well, apparently this web admin didn't appreciate this constuctive criticism very much and found the number for the President of the company and then shit rolled downhill. I was given a heads up so I knew what was comming my way. By the time I spoke with my president he wasn't really upset, it was more like, well Pete, you made fun of someone and they told on you so now we gotta pretend like their website isn't all that and apologize. I drafted a letter and had my boss preview it as well as thpresident and then conviently forgot to send it.

Medicine

2006-06-18T21:08:00.000-04:00

Holy Batshit, I have heard of this before but, this is all a little too much. That is part of what is worng with this nation, medical care. It is obcenely expensive because insurenace companies do not care how much care costs, they cover it and make up for their cost in their premiums. The helthcare providers know this and charge more and more for their services, then as if that was not enough, they scare you into thinking there are so many things out there that you need those services for.
Case in point, I have recently been diagnosed with high blood pressure, wich they tell me leads to heart attacks and to check it everyday and be careful. I also have GERD or Acid Reflux or ulcers or some shit,(over 7 years they still can not give me a straight answer) I start having weird chest pains that I have never felt before and can not associate with any other problem that I may have so I call my doctor. I get the "I have seen people younger than you have heart attacks Pete, life is too short", "in my professional opinion you need to get to the nearest emergency room right away" and here is the kicker, because I do not have health insurance, I go to the VA Clinic 20 miles away I get, "I must advise you that the VA can not cover an emergency room visit unless you go to Syracuse" Syracuse is the big VA hospitol that is about a 2 hour car ride that will cost me at least 20 bucks. Now, I am nervous becasue of all this "as soon as possible" bullshit and I go to the emergency room. do you kow how much an emergency cardiac visit is? Do you know how many x-rays they take and the EKG and everything else costs? do you know how much a 33 year old fulltime college student makes in the summer time when the only gig going is tutoring math at school 2 hours a day, 4 days a week?

Now, I am not completely ignorant, I know that they are obligated to ensure that I get the care that I should get regardless of monetary issues. I know it would not be very advisable for a health care professional to say anything else when someone calls in that may or may not be having a cardiac arrest but, shit! If I it were not for the fact that I am a bit freaked out by having high blood pressure(they actually used the phrase, "I hear your head is about to pop off") and the fact ath my grandfather on my fathers side died of a heart attack, my mothers mother had a heart attack, and not to mention that my wifes mother had her first heart attack at the age of 35, that and I am not the most stress-free person in the world....I would have never thought that I may or may not be having a heart attack and even contemplated going to the emergency room.

Now, I am not really blaming anyone at all, it is really more a problem of the system I guess, I surely can not really complain about the healthcare I recieve, I sure would not want their job but, fuck me, I almost wish they would have found something wrong in that emergency room so I could have a jsutification for the Gi-Normous bill they are going to expect me to pay two days after I get it, like thats going to happen.......

Data Destruction

2006-06-18T20:58:00.000-04:00

This site reminded me of the summer I spent working for an unspecified IT department reformating and then destroying hard drives. I still have a hard drive magnet on the hood of my sweet ride that hasn't moved in about a year...

I spent the summer removing the hard drives from pc's that were just too old to use and they were going to "dispose" of them (dispose means of course properly disposal as specified by the law, wink, wink) Anyway, we took these drives out, reformatted them, then ran them throug a three level format, all F's, all ones, all zeros. Then, as if that wasn't enough, we tore the drives apart, removed the platters, and cut the platters in as many pieces as possible and then threw it all in the trash, er, recycled them.....

What a waste of my time, you have someone who has worked in IT for 10+ years, you're paying them minimum wage, and you have them reformatting and destoying hard drives....

but, I ain't one to gossip so, you ain't heard it from me...

$$$

2006-06-18T12:26:00.000-04:00

Let me see, I can go to college this year or I can buy this...hard call

WTF

2006-06-18T12:14:00.000-04:00

you know what? This guy is an official duchebag...

Happy Early Father's Day!

2006-06-17T14:29:00.000-04:00

This is a fun article I found that seems completly tue!

schtuff

2006-06-16T21:29:00.000-04:00

I really can not argue with anything that this says....

Local News

2006-06-14T09:23:00.000-04:00

Yet another great reason to live in Upstate NY

this guy must be a friggin Genius

Cruise

2006-06-13T16:34:00.000-04:00

Maybe I can get my student loans to cover a cruise to the Galapagos Islands....

would be a pretty sweet vacation

Physics

2006-06-13T16:19:00.000-04:00

Other than Cosmomlogy, this is why I decided to become an AstroPhysics Major...

and here's a little more on the Casimir effect itself..

and a little more info as it pertains to space travel...

Whoa

2006-06-13T15:29:00.000-04:00

This little bit of majic was great, especially the way that one girl just FREAKED

Aerospace

2006-06-06T11:02:00.000-04:00

The candle that burns twice as fast, lasts half as long...

This site has some awesome pictures of Russian Aerospace technology. Not only do they protray the sheer enormity of the Vostok vehicles but, also shows the dilapitated state of the current Russian Aerospace Program. With all the effort the Russians put in during the space race of the sixties and how they were able to accomplish so much in the way of technology ond sheer willpower is overshadowed only by the inability to mainitain such a strong and powerfull program.

It would be great however, if I were independantly wealthy and could A. Go to see these things that close myself or B. Take that old space shuttle and turn it into my house, it would no doubt take wayyyy too much effort time technology to get it to actually fly at this point hehe...

WTF?

2006-06-05T12:40:00.002-04:00

I could hardly believe this article when I read it but, then again, I an believe it. Wait till the Mormons catch on to this one...

WTF?

2006-06-05T12:40:00.001-04:00

I could hardly believe this article when I read it but, then again, I an believe it. Wait till the Mormons catch on to this one...

WTF?

2006-06-05T12:40:00.000-04:00

I could hardly believe this article when I read it but, then again, I an believe it. Wait till the Mormons catch on to this one...

Zealots...

2006-06-05T09:31:00.000-04:00

sadly, this is not the first time I've heard about someone doing this...

Quotes

2006-06-04T10:10:00.000-04:00

Some of these are a bit cliche and run into the ground but, there are also some good ones in there...

Exploration

2006-06-03T21:11:00.000-04:00

It's amazing how little we really knew about the mooon before we actually landed men on the surface. It just amazed me whatching this video from the national archives how much was unknown when we landed. You tend to take information for granted. Will we really find out things that our machines were not able to tell us when we land on Mars? I think that there are some things that we will never know about Mars untill we put human eyes and feet on the martian surface but, hopefully we'll be more prepared than the Apollo astronauts were anyway...

People

2006-06-03T08:54:00.000-04:00

This guy is on to something I think...

and here is some evidence you'll have to read down the article a little bit to find the bit about the "expert"

WTF

2006-06-02T07:55:00.000-04:00

I found this site quite entertaining. I had been wondering why God doesn't heal amputees myself...

Scthuff

2006-06-01T21:40:00.000-04:00

This is pretty darn kool for those of you who rember when vinyl was all there was...

The Supontover that wouldn't go away

2006-06-01T10:01:00.000-04:00

ok, so this guy has his wife send me an email saying that he was unexpectedly shipped off to Europe for some kinda special unexpected operation for an undertermined period of time. On the one hand I'm glad that my baby isn't going to the guy but, shit, now I have to relist and it's going to sit in my father's precious yard for another two weeks...I hate people

for the backstory on the sale of the beast

Physics

2006-06-01T09:58:00.000-04:00

I now understand entanglement, thanks Amir !

that is to say, I understand the theory, how the experiments work, and the effect

next is the why, if someone figures that one out, let me know...

Posty Goodness

2006-05-25T00:48:00.000-04:00

I have been waiting for this project to get started for a while now. At lest now the StarDust project has a forum to talk about waiting for this to start...

Cogito, Ergo Es

2006-05-24T23:24:00.000-04:00

Well, here I am again, finals are over and I've been accepted to UCBoulder and NAU, not sure where we're going yet but, wer're going damn it! At any rate, I sold my creation, the majestic Supontover (Suzuki, Pontiac, Land Rover) that I built with my own two hands. Some would call it an abomination, others art, still others have nightmares where it chases them in the night through some dark rain drenched back alley...

anyway, I sold it on Ebay where I bought it from some years ago and it was sold to someone who I know isn't gonna love it as much as me, they bought it casue ti looked cool or the idea of it sounded cool to them and I know in my heart it isn't going to be what they thought it was going to be and it's going to wind up left out in thecold half torn apart eventually to be sold as scrap or towed away to sit and rot because the suck-ass wont' put up the clams to get it out of hock.

I totally kow how Dr. Frankestein felt, you have to let go even though you know it most likely will mean your creation's destruction. To you dear abonination of mine, I leave this post in rememberance, as long as I think of you, you will still exist...

2006-02-20T18:29:00.000-05:00

Well, I've made at least some progress over the winter break now, I have started priming the nosecone today

This pic shows how really big this rocket is compared to any other rocket I've done. ya, I could ahve went with a smaller rocket for level 1 certification but, I wanted to have a rocket that wouldserve as both level 1 and level 2 as well as something slow and low. The slower you go, the lower you go, the better chance of surviving a chuteless decent.....

and yes, this is in the bathroom, I had nowhere else to hang it to let it properly dry after painting. It's warm outside today(40's) but, not warm enough to let it cure outside...at least it's not a server and not actually "in" the bathtub....

Level 1 Cert

2006-02-19T20:52:00.000-05:00

Well, Motor retention is all set up, there's no way this baby's gonna come off. I didn’t' use JB Weld as others have suggested but, I used my 3 hour epoxy. I'm not worried about it really, I have used it before to bond other things that I couldn't separate with a hammer so, I believe it will hold...

anyway, still waiting on the motor casing and nomex chute protected from Red Arrow, they seem to be kind of slow and don't communicate very much if at all so, I'm not sure I'll deal much with them in the future if I can help it...

Well, hopefully someday the snow will be gone along with the wind but, until then, I'll keep building...

Level 1 Cert

2006-02-13T19:33:00.000-05:00

Well, I got my motor retention from giant leap. Not much to it really but, it's a great little piece to have for a rocket you kow you'll be flying a lot. They are kind of pricey but, it could mean the difference of having your motor casing returned safely in your rocket or loosing $100 minimum....

Level 1 Cert

2006-02-11T21:13:00.000-05:00

Well, still waiting on motor retenttion from Giant Leap, I really did expect it by today but, perhaps monday. Bought some bright yellow paint and some white primer from Walmart and ordered my motor casing and a nomex parachute protector from Red Arrow hobbies, we'll see how long it takes. I gues one of the biggest things for me is how fast a vendor can get your order shipped out. I would have ordered this stuff from BRS but, they dont' carry it. They have always been the fastest and had the best customer service I've come across so far. Giant Leap did send me an email stating they charged too much for shipping initially so gave me an extra $5 bucks off. Most other companies wouldn't have bothered...anyway, here I am waiting for parts even though I know I probably won't be able to attempt my level 1 cert until April but most likely May or June.....

i did it

2006-02-08T11:02:00.000-05:00

After prodding from the annointed one last night I decided to get a domain name. www.northernaerospace.com I was truly surprised it wasn't taken. Perhaps someday I'll be running a business with it instead of a blog, you never know....

Aerogel

2006-02-07T19:01:00.000-05:00

I soooooo wnat a piece of Aerogel

I'm not even sure exactly what I would do with it but, I would find a use, somehow, somewhere in a rockets perhaps.......

IROC Pics

2006-02-06T18:38:00.000-05:00

Here it is, just about done. Just needs the motor retainer put on and some launch lugs after it gets painted.

My motor retention is on the way from Giant Leap, they actually sent me an email telling me they cahrged too much for shipping so they geave me five bucks back..no shit!

PICS

2006-02-05T15:49:00.000-05:00

here's some more pics of the build....

PICS

2006-02-03T22:40:00.000-05:00

Added some pics to flickr tonight, here are the pics of NAE_24_PS and MAE_24_01 as well as some IROC pics...
iroc

nosecone

booster

mean mach

NAE_24_PS and NAE_24_01

2006-02-03T21:59:00.000-05:00

Northern Aerospace Experimental, 24mm_Parellel Staged
Northern Aerospace Experimental, 24mm, #01

OK, I've started my parallel staged rocket from frakensteining my Estes Mean Machine and Estes Executioner along with a few parts from BRS Hobbies. So far I have one of the boosters mostly done. I still have to build the attachment spars but, that will come after some more glue drying.

In the meantime, it seems that I now have a modified mean machine left over that's a bit shorter.....

pics to follow

Level 1 Cert

2006-01-30T22:54:00.000-05:00

Yay! it's here, and it's friggin huuuuuge! seriously, I've toted other HPR rockets around before but the IROC jsut seemed BIG when I took it out of the box! Well, pics to follow...

Experimental

2006-01-29T17:27:00.000-05:00

I soooo want to make a sugar motor

SUGAR!

Damn Good Ideas

2006-01-29T16:53:00.000-05:00

This Guy has given me a whole bunch of ideas today, isn't funny how some people can make you feel just downright dumb? Well this guy has done it, not with exceptionally over engineered and complicated procedures and processes but, with his simplicity.

First thing I'm gonna do is to design an electronics bay around PVC threaded tubing so you can just unscrew your electronics out of their bay. Take a look at his Nose Cone and you'll get my idea.

EMRR Challenge

2006-01-29T15:30:00.000-05:00

OK, made the order to BRS for two 24mm BT60 motor mounts, some launch lugs, and a couple tube couplers. Now I just need to get that stuff in, maybe some wooden dowel, a little foam board to make a bulkhead at the top of the boosters (not going to use a nosecone for weight reasons, that and it is ejecting from the tube coupler in the middle) and I should be good to go

EMRR Challenge

2006-01-29T13:34:00.000-05:00

ok, first up, parrellel staged rocket

This will be my shortened Estes Executioner (don't ask about the "shortened" part) and my Estes mean machine. I really like the executioner and always flew on E9's but, the delay was always too long, zippered a couple of time pretty good but was always repairable. It's a pretty damn stable and substantial rocket that is pretty hard to kill. The mean machine however, is just too damn big and flexible, time to cut it down to size.

The other great thing is, I only need a few parts to get this done:

2 BT60 tube couplers

2 24mm, BT60 motor mounts

some kevlar string

2 decent chutes, nothing spectacular, estes trash bags would be fine

that's about it really, I'll take some pics as this goes along, going to need it for EMRR anyway.....

Level 1 Cert

2006-01-29T10:59:00.000-05:00

ya, I'mtotally going with the QwikLOC SlimLine system, exactly what I want from Giant Leap

I'll be sure to put a little vaseline on the threads though just to help keep them clean and non-corroded...

Level 1 Cert

2006-01-29T10:49:00.000-05:00

So, the guys at RedArrow said I should have my O-ROC Monday or Tuesday, I'm thinking about motor retention. Coast Rocketry has a few different options but I really like the threded slimline type mount. I know the I-ROC comes with motor retention now, I'll have to see what it is when I get it, but I really like the idea of a threaded retainer. The whole ides of a big plate that srews down over your motor just doesn't sit well with me, first you have to make sure you have a solid spot for the screws to screw into your bird and hope that A. they hold and don't rip out, and B. The hold and don't rip out the whole aft end of your rocket. The other thing is, these are exposed screws, they aren't jsut exposed to the environment but they are exposed to rocket exhaust wich isn't the kindest on materials.

Well, we'll see what comes with the I-ROC and go from there, at least I know I can just leave a half in of motor tube out and can put the retainer on later if I want. I'll probably wait though, just need to decide if the bell shaped retainer would look better heheh...

Launch Equipment

2006-01-27T21:12:00.000-05:00

Need to recover almost completed but functional launch box from dear Mother's house (used to lauch in her backyard/field) and need to finish it up, also need to design/build new pad to incorporate rail, time to move up I spose.....

Parellel Staging Project

2006-01-27T20:56:00.000-05:00

Well, I think I'm going to go witha parellel staged rocket for my next project (along with my I-ROC for level 1 and maybe 2 Cert)

Was surfin on Essence's and found a few parellel staged projects. This one seemed interesting. I have been tryn to work out a good way to mount the boosters so that they will stay there when you want them but will deploy when you want without interfering with the sustainer. I like the way his boosters split in half to deploy and pop shutes

I think I'm going to use my Executioner and Mean machine for this project. Sadly I won't be able to count it as a kit bash becasue I'll need more parts than wht comes in the two kits together...

Experimental

2006-01-27T19:20:00.000-05:00

Well, I was going to work on a counter-weight based simple guidance system but, after careful consideration, it jsut aint' gonna werk. I could go with a gyro but, that means lots and lots of money. My epiphany came from This site wich really had some great info on gudiance theories. Another great site is The UK Rocketman.

After seeing that my low budget guidance system wasn't going to work as well as I would have liked and it would require a much larger budget than I am able to provide to create the guidance system I want (gyro's themselves go way over not to mention the guidance computer development and hardware along with the flight computer)I may very well work on a strap-on booster design that will also satisfy Essence's EMRR Challenge.

I remember when I had an Estes Gemini kit with the rear ejection and instead of ejecting the chutes, it wound up ejecting the strap-on's.

Perhaps the guidance system will be put onthe back burner for a while, no cost to do some planning and theoretical work on it, at least it will get me a little more experience for later on.....

Level 1 Cartification

2006-01-27T19:18:00.000-05:00

OK, one of the many projects I'm going to take on this semester is my level 1 high power certification. At first I wanted to design and fly my own rocket but, as I got going on an actual design and working out a parts list and cost, I jsut couldn't build what I wanted, wich was a bird I could use for both level one and level two, cheaper than what I could just buy a kit for. So after much browsing and reasearch, and checking my paypal account, I went to Red Arrow Hobbies and ordered up a fresh new LOC/Precision I-ROC , should be fine to fly on H and J's , 38mm motor mount, hopefully it will get here soon...